I know how and why the Ute was created, infact I own a 1951 Chevrolet Coupe Utility (which is VERY derelict) but I have a 1951 sedan as well

I can see a problem in the future, when the record(1527 or so as mentioned before) of dogs on utes is broken, a new number record established, only to get it all thrown out because of a definition, if the requierement, or the name of the situation/record is Utes and dogs, any pick up trucks or anything else will invalidate the new attempt, because, obviously, there are elements that are not utes, then, it will be too late to say, well, do not be so strict? we meant, trucks....too late my friend, and believe me, once you have some established record, hands will be raised all over by the people that will enjoy seing the effort go to the trash.
In the same way that, if the record in question is Dogs and Utes, what if some people show up in their utes, but, with their cats, or parrots, instead of a dog, and then these people will say, hey, common', my cat is also an animal.....yea right, but not a dog!
Late___________________

I have contacted the organizers of Dog in a Ute to see what they had to say on this topic. Here is their answer, which I totally agree with:

A ute is a comercial vehicle that requires only a car licence to drive and it has an open cargo carying space.
The first factory ute was a 1934 ford which was made by a request from a farmers wife to take pigs to market on Friday and go to church on Sunday in the one vehicle.
One could remain in the dark ages and say that a ute must have a full side of tin and a well body just as the original version but it is quite clear that the ute has evolved over time as has most machinery and vehicles in general.

A tray back, styleside, crew cab, space cab, crewman Holden, F100, F250, F350 Chev C10, C30, Dodge style sides (1970 vintage) Suzuki Swift, The Volkswagon crew cab of the 60's, the list goes on.(all these are of 3 ton capacity and less. Over that and you require a different licence)
A ute can have a canopy, hard lid, hurdles etc as these are all accessories but they all have two things in common.....
.......1; a passenger vehicle with an open cargo carrying section.
2; They only require the standard car drivers licence.

The yanks call their utes 'pick up trucks' (or trucks for short) as in the F series and GMC, Chev, Dodge Ram. Just as we do not refere to the ute as the 'utility' all that often.
The ute was an Australian invention, the yanks did not adopt our terminology 'ute'.

'Tray backs' are just a version of the ute such as the'Well body', 'Cab chassis'.
I would not like to be the person that try's to convince the thousands of farmers that the things they drive are not utes.
Deni Ute Muster will have a lot of angry and bemused people not allowed into the muster because thay drive a tray back Cruiser ? (and only have half the number for the record).
The spray contactor that removes his tray and puts a chemical tank in its place....it's still a ute.
The plumber that removes the tray and fits a tradesmans tool box in its place...it's still a ute.
Are some dogs not going to be called dogs because they have a different look or manerism about them ?

If that didn't convince you, nothing will...

dazzasute
I can hardly believe what you write as it is a total crock of ####

You write that "The first factory utes were [allegedly] made by Ford in '34", but Ford were making roadster utes as a regular production model in 1928. Why don't you already know this?
The first ute bodies were made by Holden, & used on Chev & Dodge cars in Australia in 1924.

You have obviously repeated, parrot fasion, what you have been told by other, equally ignorant people, without doing the faintest shred of research yourself. Why not? Too lazy?

The "Yanks", as you call them, frequently call their "utes" El Caminos & Rancheros.[where applicable] Why didn't you know that? I am not aware that they customarily refer to these vehicles as "trucks", do you? Didn't think so. Do you even know what a Ranchero is?
Their pickups are usually called, umm, ..... "Pickups"
Why didn't you know that either?

All of the US vehicles in your list, are in fact Pickup Trucks, just as you say, as they are all built on a commercial, or truck, chassis The Holden Crewman seems to be a double cab pickup, but not a pickup "truck" as it is passenger car derived, so you got something at least partly right.

You write that the ute has evolved over time. Evolved into what? The "cab chassis", the Tray Back [flatbed] in all it's variations, & even a crude version of the custom made "trade body" were all well known by the mid 20's, so tell me again just what the ute has evolved into, & while we are at it, perhaps you can clarify just what evolutionary trail has been followed that makes the basic layout of the current Crummydoor ute so completely diferent from the first Holden utes back in the early '50's. The same question applies to pickups. What is the evolutionary trail that makes the 1940 Ford pickup so radicly diferent from the current F100.
Basic styling updates does not constitute an answer to this question.

The class of licence required to drive a vehicle has no bearing on it's body type or description, so why did you drag that red herring in?
If it has an open back load carying area, it is one of a wide variety of "commercial" vehicles. Why don't you know these simple, but self evident facts?

Ute's can be built on either a mono constructed platform, or on a chassis, while all other types need a chassis, as the cab is always separate from the "body". The only exception that i can think of just now is the bizzarre VW, dropside flatbeds.

Why have you claimed that a ute is based on "a passenger vehicle"
Don't you realise that a single cab HiLux, which you want to call a ute, has no connection with a passenger vehicle whatsoever? It's a commercial vehicle pure & simple. Unlike the 1200 ute, it has no passenger vehicle equivalant. Even the double cab version is not regarded as a "passenger vehicle" & no registration authaurity in Australia will register one as a passenger vehicle. The same would apply to the F100 that you use as an example. Really, that was a truly stupid thing to say.

I have yet to personally find a "car savy" American that refered to his stake bed, or flat bed as a pickup. Have you? No, I didn't think so.

Take the flat bed off, as you write, & you have a cab chassis, replace it with a chemical tank & it does not get within a bulls roar of your definition of "a passenger vehicle with an open cargo carying section" so why did you use it as an illustration of your point?

If the plumber removes the tray from his flatbed truck, & replaces it with a special "tradesmans tool box" body, it becomes a trade body vehicle, but this too seems to fall outside your definition of "a passenger vehicle with an open cargo carying section" Thats two bad examples, isn't it. Your lack of homework on this subject is really showing.

You say that,..We do not refer to the ute as a "utility" all that often. This is true, but whats your point?

"A ute can have a canopy, hard lid, hurdles etc", & yes, they are all accessories, but what does this have to do with the basic argument about what constitutes a ute? If you can tell me, please do, as i am really interested in this one.

You write that "Deni Ute Muster will have a lot of angry & bemused people not allowed into the muster because they drive a tray back Cruiser" Whats your point? Are you saying that we should supress truth because some people are too ignorant to understand the diference between the term "commercial vehicle" as a blanket description, & "ute" as a specific body type within the commercial vehicle sphere. To do so would be to drag us all into the "dark ages" of ignorance where you seem to feel so comfortable. Instead of upsetting the non ute owners, why not give the event a name that more accurately reflects the nature of the event? That shouldn't be so hard should it? Why didn't you think of that?

You write that "the ute was an Australian invention [true], the yanks [there's that word again] did not adopt our terminology" That too is correct, but what's your point? You are trying to convey something here, but what is it?
By saying "Australian invention" you acknowledge that it was not previously known elsewhere in the world. That makes it unique, distinct, & separate from all other commercial body types. In this one sentence you have agreed with all that i have said, yet you continue to argue that what you have said in this one sentence is not true. Do you even know what you are saying?

Here's a thought. Instead of trying to drag us all down to your level of ignorance, why don't you apply a little energy to researching the subject & learn a thing or two. Then you won't be running around calling a contractor's chemical tank a "ute"

Obviously your post didn't convince me, & with reasoning as patently ill researched as this, "nothing" would have been a better argument.

As for the dog thing, i guess that if you are happy to embrace ignorance & get one subject all wrong, then why stop at just one subject. After all, a cat is a mammal, a quadraped, has fur, a tail, kills things, eats meat, copulates "doggy style", & lives in peoples homes, so whats the diference?
There is certainly a lot less diference in that simple description than the diference between a Cruiser dropside flat bed, a Datsun 1200 ute, or a contractors chemical tank, all of which you want to call by the same name

P.S. To the best of my knowledge, the Suzuki Swift that you mention in your post, is a passenger car. I do not believe that it was ever made as a ute. Can anyone confirm or refute?


The photo is of a 1928 Ford model A. "flare side ute". The rag top is what makes it a "roadster" ute & it was a catalogued production model in Australia, It is one of the models that you infer didn't exist. This one has been retrofitted with 1929 doors, which had external handles, for convenience sake, along with a period correct canopy as it is used for camping out.
Note the one piece body from the rear of the door to the tailgate. THATS what makes it a UTE. A pickup has a separate pickup bed.

A-NAL.

Now, whats that rectal reference supposed to mean? If you have something constructive to add, then don't be shy.

Could it be that the popular usage of the word "ute" has evolved? Let's leave it at that. According to Holden it originally meant something else, but now according to popular usage it means something broader. Good enough. Like the word "hacker": now it implies deviant behavior but that was definitely not the original usage. Ditto for thousands of other english words.

i think the meant that tiny little suzuki ute thing of the 1980s... the tiny useless thing that looks like a squashed swift, you could almost fit it in the back of a 1200 ute

So all knowing Dodgeman, is a Datsun a Nissan? and is a Nissan still a Nissan if its owned by Renault?

This whole topic is getting ugly!!!! My personal oppion is the a ute is anything that is/or has a cab and what ever on the back, be it a flat bed tray or what ever. I dont give two fuks if someone else thinks different to me, cos hey thats there right to think how the want to.

This whole thing is about everyones own indiviual oppion and calling others names and sht is not an adult way to deal with this.

If others out there want to call me names, ooohhh I'm shaking in my boots!!!!

But hey this its just my oppion and my 0.02 cents.

Remeber what this site is about...... help out others with the Datsun 1200!

Blair