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Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
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Posts: 1054
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Went junk hunting at the scrap metal place today. Dug in one of those big bags and found some perfect stainless plate, it still has it's protective plastic covering on. Had them cut me a piece of 100mm stainless pipe from a long piece that was there and also found that cone. The 100mm pipe and plate I'll use to make a surge tank with. You don't often find cones so when I find them I take it even if I don't need it, it's wall is about 2mm so it's fine for a transition for an exhaust. I also happened on a bunch of filler wire that was stuck in there, on closer inspection it turn's out to be 316L, so I took that as well.
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Got a tip from Rotor that I should use stainless filler rod for the welding then it comes out nicer, so I immediately had to try it. Though he did say he uses 304, I'll get some of that for the manifolds and use this 316 for pure stainless. It comes out very nice I think, much, much better than the steel filler wire anyway... I just need some practice still to get it perfect.
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I didn't try to TIG stainless the other day, so I just cut this piece and joined it back together to test and see if stainless is as easy. I'd say the stainless is almost easier to do. I did find that I could turn the amps down a bit and still get the penetration but without the cauliflower on the inside.
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Ok on to some car stuff. I made a new bolt for the brake pedal that does the adjustment. Initially I thought I'd cut a piece of the Golf clutch pushrod and weld it onto the original bolt, but I don't like welding in that area. So I got a capscrew with the same thread, and found that the pushrod would go into the hex on the end. Then I just used the TIG to add another nut on the end of it to make the hole slightly deeper to ensure the push rod has no chance of ever falling out and then cut a piece of the pushrod to suit.
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Here's the lot fitted. The rod goes about 50mm into the master's sleeve and about 10mm into the bolt head, so it's not coming out there.
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And the master finally fitted with the adapter plate sprayed in black.
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I just took some pictures of the clutch setup for posterity, since a bunch of people have asked me how my setup works. It just mounts on top of the pedal box with a bracket made up of some flatbar and angle iron. How do I fill it? When the dash is instaleld, you can see the top of the bottle through the window vent, I just take the top of and suck some fluid into a transparent pipe and let it run in there. Theoretically it shouldn't ever leaked, it never has, and you shouln't need to add fluid ever, I never have, so I thought it was ok to be in there.
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The original hook on the end of the pedal is just cut off and replaced with a piece of flatbar, which is just drilled and the pedal is done. Even with the double diaphragm pressure plate it was never hard to push the clutch. I'll take some pictures of how the pipe runs from the clutch master down when that is installed.
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Ok an finally I took the dust plate of the motor to have it scanned for ScoobySTi. I thought it would cover the bellhousing completely, since the 16V one was just half and the bottom half was completely open with that. Unfortunately it seems the dust plate is still not exactly like the bell, but it does cover much more of it. So what I'll do is to have it scanned, but add about 10mm around the bottom edge so it completely covers the bellhousing. Provision was made in the bellhousing to drill and tap holes to bolt the cover down, so then I'll do that too. So I'll also have them cut me one which I'll be cutting and adding the hump into, have and idea around that.
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Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:19
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
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Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
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Posts: 1054
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Ok so I've decided that I'll simply use the brake master from the original master/booster combo that came out of a 1400 bakkie. I'm hoping the size increase of the Almera caliper and Alfa caliper pistons over the standard Datsun/Nissan 1400 fair will help that the brakes won't be to hard. Just removing the master from the booster already makes it push much easier, since you are no longer pushing against that huge spring inside the booster.

Anyway, with this adapter plate I can easily unbolt it and fit back the booster if need be or I can fit another smaller master to increase the ratio so the brakes are softer.

Thought I'd make this plate the old fasioned way, using what I have at home. Used a piece of 8mm plate and stuck a 1:1 print of the adapter I drew with cad onto the metal plate. Then punched the holes and started drilling and tapping and finally just cut it out. The big center hole was perhaps the biggest job, as I had to drill a whole bunch of 3mm holes all around the edge of the circle, then knock it out with a hammer and chisel and then file it out to the right size with a rotary file in the drill.
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Test fit to the master. I used some 8mm studs I had lying around to bolt the master to the plate.
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Then a test fit in the car to see how much space I gain and I'm sure it will help a lot. It looks good enough anyway, will spray the plate black.
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Here's a comparison between having the booster in and out. I'm sure I'll be able to fit proper ram tubes now...
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If I'm still short of space because of the bottles, I'll just use a remote mount bottle for the brakefluid and move it more into the corner.

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:18
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
Offline
I got some stuff done tonight, mainly on the engine, also started working out how to mount only the master for the brakes. I'm going to ditch the booster for now, if the brakes are to hard or not strong enough I'll fit it back.

Here's the solution I came up with for joining the pre-circulation pipes from the water pump to the top outlet. Used regular copper tubing, that's normally used for plumbing, and just soldered something up. Look at the edges of the pipe where I cleaned and applied some solder right on the edge to make a hump to keep the rubber pipe from popping off when the clamp is tightened and it starts taking pressure.
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Then I just painted it black to make it blend in a bit better.
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And a test fit. Shouldn't be to obvious from above.
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I removed the master form the booster, and started to take some measurements for an adapter plate. I'll have that cut and fit the master so long. Came up with a good idea for the puch rod to actuate the brakes, had a brand new push rod from a VW Golf gearbox lying around(yes Gambit, another VW part), which I'll cut and use along with a allen bolt to make the pushrod with.

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:12
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
Offline
Here's some pictures of the ECU I'll be using, it's a XMS4C from www.perfectpower.com . Lot's of guys using them over here and having great succes with them. Full closed loop wide lambda support and 8 auxiliary outputs which can be controlled with 16 setpoints in any combination of and/or
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Also their own ingition module which has internal overheat protection and fault indication.

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:06
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
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Posts: 1054
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Ok so today I stripped the gearbox to see what's up in there. It kept jumping out of 4th when you decelerated in gear or just changed up and went into cruising mode.

To open the gearbox undo the bolts around the waist that goes through the sandwich plate.
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Now the rear housing can come off, just give it a wiggle so the gear selector comes out of it's slot. When I opened it up the spring that holds the speedo gear in it's place was lying on the 5th gear, visible on the left set of gears. That explains why the speedo wasn;t working anymore, no idea how it unhooked.
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To get the gearset out of the front housing, you need to remove the front bearing cover, undo all the bolts around it's edges.
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When it comes of, there's two circle-clips holding the bearings in their positions, taek them off then the housing will come of.
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The whole gearset then comes out and you have easy access to everything.
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Here's the two gearsets I have. The lefthand one with the steel sandwich plate is the one I bought the gearbox with, I removed that when the selector broke after a very excited gear change at Killarney doing the 1/4, The one on the right is the one I took out of a gearbox we found at a scrap metal dealer, and has been doing duty without fail. Only thing is it jumped out of 4th, but after carefull measurements I found out why. The aluminium gearset must be from a W55 gearbox, because all the carrier bearings are narrower then the steel plated one's, so specifically the one on the main input shaft wasn't positioning the input shaft as far back as it should. That means when you hooked 4th, which simply locks the input and output shaft together for a 1:1 ratio, it didn't engage completely which would kick it out. There's some more reasona I found which makes the alu one a W55, read on...
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Ok now I went ahead and counted some teeth. My mother always said, "sit jy alweer en tanne tel?", but I don't think this is what she meant...

Here is what I found, keep in mind that I bought the gearbox with the steel sandwich plate and replaced it with the alu one later on. Look at the chat below, I was going to do it with a calculator, but folded to the charms of Excel. In the right most column I included the ratios for the different gearboxes as from this page, http://users.tpg.com.au/users/loats/technical/ma61/gearboxes.html, The ratios indicate which gearbox it is.

BLUE gear ratios, these are the ratios that were in the steel sandwich plate I bought the gearbox with. They correspond to the ratios for the W57, which means I must have bought a W57.

GREEN gear ratios, these are the ratios that were in the aluminium sandwich plate I bought. They are the same as the W55 ratios, and the fact that this gearset's carrier bearings are also narrower than the steel ones, affirms that this must be a "lesser" W55 gearset. It stil survived extremely hard launches as anyone who knows my car and saw me drive it can confirm. So a W55 is plenty strong, but obvisouly it'll konk out before a W57/8.

RED gear ratios, these ratios are a combination of the blue and green ratios. Now on these boxes the intermediate shaft is solid ie. the transfer gears for 1 through 3rd are part of the intermediate shaft as is the gear that meshes with the input shaft. Which means that if you want to change gear ratios for 1-3rd gear you also have to change the intermediate shaft and the input shaft. The only gear that is removable is the 5th gear, both on the intermediate shaft and the output shaft. Now the only difference between the W57 and W58 gearboxes are the 5th gears, with the 5th gear in the W58 being taller than the W57. So what I did is I plugged the 5th gear from the W55's numbers onto the input ratios of the W57, and what do you get? Yes that right, you get a W58, as can be seen in the right most column.
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The gear calculation is, (Output/Intermediate)*(Intermediate/Input), going backwards through the teeth numbers in the sheet. So for the 1st gear of the W57 it would be (34/14)*(46/34)=3.286, and so on and so forth.

This means that I'll be re-fitting the steel sandwich plate but with the W55's 5th gear ratios installed, so that I have a W58. Only place this is going to make a difference is when you cruise the RPM's will be a bit lower, but also the W57/8 gearboxes' 1st through 3rd will be longer than the W55's.

My only concern now is that I've fitted that 3.3:1 diff ratio vs the old 4.3:1. I'm a bit worried that, that might be a bit to tall now. Let's see what the calculator says...

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:04
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
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Ok on to some pictures.

Here' a better closeup of the finished and unfinished part.
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It fit's in the flange I had cut for the front of the throttles perfectly.
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Nice radius on the lip.
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The other end also flares open in a lip, so it'll transition nicely to the larger throttle.
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If I mount these straight on the throttles and I really want to since it will make building a plenum much easier, then I'll have to delete the brake booster, I'm sure of it. Otherwise I'll have to mount them at a 45 angle or so to miss the brake booster. So that booster has less and less luck of ever returning to the engine bay.

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:04
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
Offline
It helps to have a dad with 42 years of experience in modifying and making all kinds of stuff for cars...

He found some part on some engine that looked like it can be a ram tube. So he brought it and we checked, and it's perfect! I have to add I've been scouring the Woolies and other shops with stainless cups and stuff nonstop for stainless egg holders, which when cut correctly also make the perfect ram tube...

Here's an unfinished one in the foreground and a finished one in the background.
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He said the parts are stainless, we checked with a magnet too and they don't stick. They measure 43mm on the inside, so they are exactly the same size as the throttles and are about 70mm long. While their lips don't fold all the way around, I had another idea while we were checking if they fit. My dad said we can probably try to fold them further, but I said no leave them as is, their flow will be ok for when I want to drive without a plenum.

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:03
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
Offline
Sooooo, I've been dying to try TIG for very long now. Just never got around to get my hands on a bottle of Argon. Saw one advertised on Gumtree yesterday and after some negotiations the owner dropped it of at my place exactly when I said I'd be home. In a Honda Ballade nogals, he poked the bottle through the ski hatch... Honda driver darem... :|

Anyway, here's my torch and guages, have had them for 4 years now and never been taken out the boxes. Ok once to take a peak but never again...
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And the missing link, still full and sealed.
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No more flux, flipping noxious fumes and sparks flying everywhere. :mrgreen:

Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:03
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined:
2006/7/12 1:44
From Cape Town ZA
Group:
Registered Users
Posts: 1054
Offline
Ok so I've done something tonight while the chicken was on the braai. I want to make the plug wire cover smooth so that you don't see the Toyota lettering, not that I mind that, it's just more inconspicuous if Toyota isn't blaring of the top of the motor...

Cover before doing anything, still good condition, so it'll polish right up.
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After a bunch of sanding with a rotary disk in the drill and a good old sander.
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I was worried about the lettering coming out properly, sometimes when you sand something like this away the letters will just keep popping out. Ask anyone who sprays cars. So I thought I'd spray it black since that always shows any inconsistencies immediately. Look smooth enoug. Only thing that happened, I didn't know the Toyota badge is actually a loose badge that's melted in with four prongs. The one fell out of it's hole, will just plug it up with some filler.
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Close up, this is still just a rough finish, used 100 grit in the sander. Letters don't show at all though, so it worked perfectly. Will smooth it out with some 300 and then 1000 or so. Will then go drop this and the other two timing covers off at Jackie's to be sprayed the same blue the car is.
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Posted on: 2011/12/5 12:02
_________________
1200 GX Sedan
New(being installed)
4AGE 20V NA

Old
4AGZE 16V turbo
196.5KW/283NM
800m - 200km/h
400m - 12.3s
Transfer the post to other applications Transfer


Re: Boksie 3.0 complete rebuild.
Home away from home
Joined:
2009/4/16 10:37
From Cape Town, South Africa
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Posted on: 2011/9/21 13:44
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Project Build: http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=45104&forum=9

Don't find a problem, find a solution!!!!
www.race-tech.co.za
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