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Windage trays and crank scrapers
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Following on from the Australians chaps looking at doing a bulk buying deal on windage trays/ crank scrapers has anyone had any experience with using these and if so what sort of horsepower gains/ operating temperature drops have you experienced if any?
Always difficult to wade through the b.s of so called testamonials that web sites invariably have, however logic would say that they seem to be a great idea to not only enhance power but also longevity/ reliabilty.
Cheers
Dave


Posted on: 2006/9/1 8:39
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
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someone recently posted ( last month or 2 ) about having crank scrapers in production, perhaps in the states though.

i think the primary benefit is the small increase in power by removing excess oil from the crank and getting it back to the pump, so it's not going to do anything magic, and there are other ways to keep the oil pump fed, but it will help hot engines a little.

an oil cooler would probably do more good in the long run.

Posted on: 2006/9/1 17:53
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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I made one for my Turbo A12... The only way to really see if it makes HP is to dyno a motor with std sump, then change the sump and redyno.

It was a little bit of mucking around but if nothing else, at least you tried to make something better...

Ive never had oil surge and made it in such away that I can run the oil level about 10mm higher on the dip stick and still be below the baffle plate I put in there...

Posted on: 2006/9/2 15:22
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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Most of the time the only time you hear of anybody using such scappers in the oil pan is in competion cause there is such small gains , & in competion you need every little bit. when the crankshaft rotates at high RPM's it creates a balloon of oil that the crankshaft has to rotate through, the object is to disturb this balloon , or remove it so the crank doesn't have to rotate through it.

Posted on: 2006/9/2 16:45
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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They way I heard it was:
- At 6000 rpm, there's no improvement
- At 8000 rpm, it helps
- At 10000 rpm, you need it (and a dry sump)

But you might as well hear from the experts:

Ishihara-Johnson
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Posted on: 2006/9/3 5:44
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
Just popping in
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Quote:

B110SSS wrote:
Following on from the Australians chaps looking at doing a bulk buying deal on windage trays/ crank scrapers has anyone had any experience with using these and if so what sort of horsepower gains/ operating temperature drops have you experienced if any?
Always difficult to wade through the b.s of so called testamonials that web sites invariably have, however logic would say that they seem to be a great idea to not only enhance power but also longevity/ reliabilty.
Cheers
Dave


Hi Dave,

I make the scrapers on the site. There is absolutely no need to trust what I say on the site. Simply examine modern stock Nissan engines for scraper technology. They are one of the biggest users. Trust the engineers from the company that built your engine.

Posted on: 2007/4/7 15:14
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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Quote:

B210sleeper wrote:
someone recently posted ( last month or 2 ) about having crank scrapers in production, perhaps in the states though.

i think the primary benefit is the small increase in power by removing excess oil from the crank and getting it back to the pump, so it's not going to do anything magic, and there are other ways to keep the oil pump fed, but it will help hot engines a little.

an oil cooler would probably do more good in the long run.


The testing by Ed Peters on the 2.4 setup on the homepage was for a NA engine with the factory turbo oil cooler. That was done in an OEM level dyno cell where the environmental conditions are normalized.

Ed paid for the parts -- ask him. Very nice guy. By the way, he has tested aftermarket parts that raised the oil temperature rather than lowered it. He is not afraid to say that either. Ask him.

There are many good reasons that most of the OEMs in the world now include scraper tech in at least some of their stock engines.

Posted on: 2007/4/7 15:22
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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Quote:

hotrod88 wrote:
Most of the time the only time you hear of anybody using such scappers in the oil pan is in competion cause there is such small gains , & in competion you need every little bit. when the crankshaft rotates at high RPM's it creates a balloon of oil that the crankshaft has to rotate through, the object is to disturb this balloon , or remove it so the crank doesn't have to rotate through it.


Well, every new stock DaimlerChrysler engine that I looked at had scraper tech in it. I have pictures, of course. But that's part of the B.S. at the website.


Seriously, there is absolutely no need to reference racing to prove the technology is considered sound engineering by professional automotive engineers. That patent from G.M. on the site illustrates that it is considered common background knowledge for experts in the field of windage control.

Posted on: 2007/4/7 15:31
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
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Quote:

ddgonzal wrote:
They way I heard it was:
- At 6000 rpm, there's no improvement
- At 8000 rpm, it helps
- At 10000 rpm, you need it (and a dry sump)

But you might as well hear from the experts:

Ishihara-Johnson
Open in new window


The dyno data we have generated and received back from a variety of engine configurations indicates that power starts to increase roughly around 2750 rpm and that it peaks at 2% to 3% at the maximum rpms for the engine (NA).

The Metro three cylinder peaked at 5300 rpm and had 3% return, for example. Look at the stock Ford FE pan with a scraper in the floor. Big old stock V8s rarely ran over 4500 rpms, yet there is that scraper.

If you look at relatively recent (2004) SAE papers you will learn that a steady 2000 rpms is sufficient to generate enough foam to fill a crankcase. That research was done at MIT.

Posted on: 2007/4/7 15:39
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Re: Windage trays and crank scrapers
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
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I bought 2
They look great
Stronger than I though
Well designed

Windage trays that is
No scraper yet

Posted on: 2007/4/7 18:27
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