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Main : Mechanical : Engine Head games

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Head games
Head gamesPopular
SubmitterstirlingmacMore Photos from stirlingmac   Last Update2002/10/17 1:27    Tell a friendTell a friend
Hits22638  Comments34    0.00 (0 votes)0.00 (0 votes)
OK who wants to tell us whats going on here? It's an A series block but whats the head??

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Poster Thread
cheater_5
Posted: 2007/6/4 20:03  Updated: 2007/6/4 20:03
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2005/8/8
From: The garage, NZ
Posts: 1922
 Re: Head games
HEY, THATS MY OIL PUMP!!!! rad

Poster Thread
ddgonzal
Posted: 2007/6/5 7:33  Updated: 2007/6/5 7:33
Moderator
Joined: 2001/5/3
From: 48 North
Posts: 31594
 Re: Head games
Read more about the AY12 engine here: Wiki - AY12 Engine

Poster Thread
datracer
Posted: 2005/7/8 7:58  Updated: 2005/7/8 7:58
Not too shy to talk
Joined: 2005/6/27
From: Carson City,NV USA
Posts: 26
 Re: Head games
the bottom end is an A-series block.the head is a two valve hemi chamber configuration. the valves are pushrod and rocker arm accuated. being a crossflow head it puts the carbs on the right side of the motor so the distributor has a 90 deg. adaptor that lies it down under the carbs facing rearward.the distributor also has an 8 plug cap because the head has two plugs per cylinder. when I can find them I will put the picks up.

Poster Thread
D
Posted: 2005/7/14 11:01  Updated: 2005/7/14 11:01
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/10/28
From: under the Firmament LOL no twiglight effect BS
Posts: 10926
 Re: Head games
Bump

dragging out this thread out again...but what was last posted got me itching...

"when I can find them I will put the picks up"

What the .....?

You mean you have more pics or own a few of these setups!!!!????

Poster Thread
rb20
Posted: 2005/7/14 11:11  Updated: 2005/7/14 11:11
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2004/8/29
From: south australia
Posts: 1532
 Re: Head games
i have a mazda 1500 with a ub motor
and its all wrong
the exaughst and carbs are on oposite
sides to the one in the pick and the ub ha the dizzy poking out the frount drivers side of the head thts the right side for all you americans

Poster Thread
rb20
Posted: 2005/7/14 11:24  Updated: 2005/7/14 11:24
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2004/8/29
From: south australia
Posts: 1532
 Re: Head games
did a reply just disapear or am i talking to myself

Poster Thread
matbighat
Posted: 2006/2/24 7:19  Updated: 2006/2/24 7:19
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2001/1/30
From: California
Posts: 2973
 Re: Head games
rb, i want sum of whatever you been smok'n

Poster Thread
Dodgeman
Posted: 2004/4/9 12:41  Updated: 2004/4/9 12:41
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2003/6/27
From: Southern Tablelands N.S.W. Australia
Posts: 8287
 Re: Head games
Did anyone determine what this head actually comes from?

Amongst the list of observations, did anyone notice that the clutch cable is disconected at the trans end, & the security device on the master cylinder caps looks high tech.

Poster Thread
DatA15
Posted: 2004/4/10 7:26  Updated: 2004/4/10 7:26
Home away from home
Joined: 2003/9/25
From: Adelaide
Posts: 594
 Re: Head games
i want !!!

Poster Thread
webbs1200
Posted: 2002/10/29 12:49  Updated: 2002/10/29 12:49
Just can't stay away
Joined: 2002/7/25
From: Philadelphia, PA
Posts: 115
 Re: Head games
From a Pulsar

Poster Thread
ddgonzal
Posted: 2002/10/30 4:09  Updated: 2002/10/30 4:09
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From: 48 North
Posts: 31594
 Re: Head games
Quote:
monster "pachyderms" found in old Chryslers

The chrylser/valiant semi-hemi was the "poly" 318 engine (pre-1968 318), right? I thought pachyderm referred to Hemis like the 50's engines. And that "mastodon" was the 426 hemi.

My guess is that the engine here is not very exotic. It's just a crossflow engine GA (or whatever) friom an 80s front-wheel-drive Nissan with custom carby setup.

Poster Thread
dimlight65
Posted: 2002/10/30 15:18  Updated: 2002/10/30 15:18
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2001/2/7
From: Fort Worth, Texas, USA
Posts: 1003
 Re: Head games
Oops, sorry. I was just shooting my mouth off. I really know very little about Chrylser's Hemis, except they are pretty doggone cool. I dig those big-assed valve covers!
I had always heard the 426 referred to as an "Elephant Engine" hence the pachyderm crack. I knew there WERE other Hemis before that one, but know nothing about them.
The photo appears to me to be a similar design. Yes, similar to a design I know nothing about. Oh, Leave me alone would you? I'm leaving this discussion now!

Poster Thread
bent_axel_bob
Posted: 2002/10/30 17:34  Updated: 2002/10/30 17:34
Home away from home
Joined: 2001/10/14
From: canberra australia
Posts: 286
 Re: Head games
well i be sayin its a xflow push rod 8 plug head but if u look carefull is tha a blanking plate over where the dizzy slips in ???? the carbs are hot sticks i like but thats about all i can say except it looks very izuzu ? but there ohc but cross flow looks prety serous all the same

Poster Thread
ddgonzal
Posted: 2003/1/29 21:48  Updated: 2003/1/29 21:48
Moderator
Joined: 2001/5/3
From: 48 North
Posts: 31594
 Re: Head games
Hey, there's a picture of an engine like this at Pitroad. It's marked as: A12 200 1973.11.23 XI-R.

That would explain the dizzy blanking plate, it's an A12 block?

Poster Thread
ddgonzal
Posted: 2003/1/31 3:48  Updated: 2003/1/31 3:48
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Joined: 2001/5/3
From: 48 North
Posts: 31594
 Re: Head games
A friend helped me translate the Pitroad caption for the A12 engine. It apparently says:

[something] Victory 200
A12 crossflow engine
November 23, 1973 Fuji Speedway
Cherry XI-R [something]

The Cherry is of course the Pulsar family and the E10 was the first (1971-1974). The Cherry X1-R is talked about on the CHERRYCOUPE site.

The Fuji Series 5 race (November 23, 1973) is listed here

To have Internet Explorer show the correct characters when viewing the Japanese pages, click the View menu, click Encoding, click More, then Japanese (auto select).

Poster Thread
D
Posted: 2003/2/17 11:08  Updated: 2003/2/17 11:08
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/10/28
From: under the Firmament LOL no twiglight effect BS
Posts: 10926
 Re: Head games
My better halve is japanese and says its well DD has already said it...
The design is definately Toyota T series based Ive owned 8 celicas and 3 corolla ke25 with all engine combos from and non factory.
It obvious just the only improvements over the gx are a hemi design chamber with central plugs and 45 angled valves assisting the crossflow layout with headers angled to assist exhaust flow out of the chambers with crank angle sensor ignition. It apparantely from race history text on the web and on my Jap retro car mag that they raced with higer power than the kidney chambered gx but without the reliability. The ohv tc engine is a beaut and produces 103 hp from 1.6 single tiny carb. If I get the time after my trip Ill rip a few heads of at the wreckers and see if anything lines up (I hope it does!!)
But why the coil is disconnected is a real mystery. Part of the Datsun love - Datsun things can be mysterious. But sometimes I get sick of not being able to get stuff of the shelf like the v8 clones can unless with spend for Nismoney stuff.

Poster Thread
matbighat
Posted: 2003/7/11 3:08  Updated: 2003/7/11 3:08
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2001/1/30
From: California
Posts: 2973
 Re: Head games
This is an ultra rare Nissan motorsports Japan "rallye" crossflow head. A different version of these low-run, sand cast aluminum heads were made for L4 and L6 engines as well.

Poster Thread
D
Posted: 2003/7/11 8:35  Updated: 2003/7/11 8:35
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
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From: under the Firmament LOL no twiglight effect BS
Posts: 10926
 Re: Head games
It looks like though it was never finished in this engine bay cause even one of the bolts is missing on top of the rocker cover (the middle one) where another chrome one should be but there is just a chrome washer.
As for someone already pointing out the dizzy it could be that this Maniac couldnt afford the electromotive type direct fire crank angle sensor at the time.
I wonder if this head did better than the A non crossflow one?

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ddgonzal
Posted: 2004/4/8 19:49  Updated: 2004/4/8 19:49
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From: 48 North
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 Re: Head games
Hmmm. The Pitroad photo is of an engine like this, but in fwd car. This photo is in rwd car?

www.datsuncherry.ch identifies this photo as (translated from German):Quote:
A15 engine with crossflow cylinder head with approx. 220 HP by Nissan (here in a Datsun 1200)

Poster Thread
Dodgeman
Posted: 2004/4/9 4:09  Updated: 2004/4/9 4:09
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2003/6/27
From: Southern Tablelands N.S.W. Australia
Posts: 8287
 Re: Head games
I know it was a while ago, but since this thread has been resurected i will respond to an earlier post here that asked about the Chrysler engines.

The Polysphere engine that was refered to started life in about '56 & is rightly known as the "A" series of engines. They were never used in the Valiant range of cars. This combustion chamber design was also commonly refered to as the "semi hemi" & these engines were designed for the Plymouth division. Aussies may remember them in Dodge Phoenix cars, but these were realy re-badged Plymouths for export markets anyway.

These "A" engines were redesigned in the early 60's with wedge combustion chambers, & thinwall casting technology was used to produce the "LA" series of engines. This is what was used in the Valiants in all of the four capacities that they were made in.

The Hemi engines from the 50's were often refered to as "whales," particularly the Chrysler versions, but this name has slipped from general use. These engines are now more widely known simply as "early hemi's"

The 426 Hemi has always been known as the Elephant, & sometimes refered to as the Pachyderm by the inteligensia. This engine is still available new, in a crate, in several versions all the way up to 528 cubic inches.[about 8.59L] It only takes money to own one. [lots of it]

Mastadon is the name of a series of solid [no water core] alloy cylinder heads for early Chrysler hemis that are obviously for race use only. They are still available new.

There were two other families of Polysphere engines & both were based on the hemi cylinder blocks. The first, in '54 was based on the little 241 Dodge block, while the Chrysler, in '55 was based on a special, smaller bore, Chrysler hemi block. This reverted to the stock Chrysler bore size the following year. Neither of these two engine designs made it to 1960.

The Datsun engine in the photo appears to be a relatively simple pushrod hemi design. It's certainly a step up from the original cylinder head design, but not a really big step as far as technology goes.

Note that the fourth carb does not have an air trumpet due to inteference with the master cylinder. The missing coil wire, carb trumpet, cam cover nut etc. suggests a project in the closing stages of construction, or undergoing redevelopment or maintainance.

There seem to be an awfull lot of plug wires for a 4 cyl engine, & where the hell are they coming from?

Poster Thread
ddgonzal
Posted: 2004/4/9 4:15  Updated: 2004/4/9 4:15
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Joined: 2001/5/3
From: 48 North
Posts: 31594
 Re: Head games
Quote:
I wonder if this head did better than the A non crossflow one?
You mean in winning races? There probably is some record of this in the Cherry race cars.

But 220hp (with this head) vs 150hp (with GX head) for A12 engines sounds good.

Poster Thread
1200rallycar
Posted: 2004/4/9 5:29  Updated: 2004/4/9 5:29
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/3/20
From: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 8221
 Re: Head games
i've seen a couple of a12's with e15 heads now, both at one guys place, he builds em for his sprint cars, next time i go im taking a camera!!!

its very impressive and although they are using methanol they are getting 220hp from an a12, revving around the 10,500 mark

they are so sick!!!!!!!!!!!!!

when i run into some cash these dudes are definately building me a motor!

Poster Thread
b310gx
Posted: 2002/10/17 11:26  Updated: 2002/10/17 11:26
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
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From: sydney australia
Posts: 1858
 Re: Head games
it could be a factory az head,which is one of those rare as parts we all wish we could stumble across,owned by somebody who doesn't know what it's really worth.

Poster Thread
cfwase
Posted: 2002/10/17 9:05  Updated: 2002/10/17 9:05
Home away from home
Joined: 2002/6/17
From: auckland, new Zealand
Posts: 154
 Re: Head games
isnt it one of those aftermarket twincam heads you can buy for about $7000?

Poster Thread
cfwase
Posted: 2002/10/17 23:51  Updated: 2002/10/17 23:51
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From: auckland, new Zealand
Posts: 154
 Re: Head games
judging by the engine id say the owner knows how much its worth.
it looks pretty serious.

Poster Thread
1200rallycar
Posted: 2002/10/18 4:41  Updated: 2002/10/18 4:41
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/3/20
From: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 8221
 Re: Head games
mate, whats going on here?

its cross flow too!

what are the carbs?
what's going on with the exhaust?
does that pipe near oil pump go to an oil cooler?
whats the radiator?

this things weird, where did the pic come from?

[edit]

if it was twin cam wouldnt it have a belt or chain cover up the front of the motor to drive the cam, or is there an old school twin cam which isnt overhead and looks like standard as far as that is concerned

Poster Thread
Lobster
Posted: 2002/10/18 10:25  Updated: 2002/10/18 10:25
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/8/25
From: Canberra, Australia
Posts: 1618
 Re: Head games
Well, it isn't goign to run very well with the coil not hooked up.
So the guy should just give the car to me...


Ok whats it off?
It's not off anything normal...

Poster Thread
dimlight65
Posted: 2002/10/18 14:34  Updated: 2002/10/18 14:34
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
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From: Fort Worth, Texas, USA
Posts: 1003
 Re: Head games
I'm betting it isn't a twin cam or even an overhead cam. It looks to me like it is some kind of "semi-hemi," a hemispherical chamber pushrod head for the A-series bottom end. Similar to the Toyota TC series of engines found in the Corollas, or the monster "pachyderms" found in old Chryslers.
As for the carbs, they appear to be motorcycle carbs that work like SUs.
I loves that header! I thought the Chickenhawk had a bundle of snakes!

Poster Thread
datto_dave
Posted: 2002/10/23 8:47  Updated: 2002/10/23 8:47
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From: Toowoomba, australia
Posts: 212
 Re: Head games
it looks to me as if it's got twin spak plugs too. oh my god what a machine. i bow down before thee

Poster Thread
Davo1200
Posted: 2002/10/23 15:18  Updated: 2002/10/23 15:18
Home away from home
Joined: 1999/3/11
From: Sydney
Posts: 595
 Re: Head games
That is a strange one. The guy is obviously halfway through the conversion. The head is definately Nissan. It reads so on the rocker. Not overhead cam either. 8 leads but for some reason theres no lead running to the dizzy from the coill. The rear carb has been shortened to clear the master cylinder which suggests the car is RHD. Wierd pipes and an oil cooler. Cool. I want one!

Scott

Poster Thread
shoom
Posted: 2002/10/24 10:45  Updated: 2002/10/24 10:45
Home away from home
Joined: 2002/8/19
From: Perth, West Aussie
Posts: 324
 Re: Head games
could it be a head off of a H or J series motor? I dont think nissan would have gone to the trouble of making a one off ohv head when they could have gone ohc or dohc just as easily. I think he will have to run crank angle ignition, because the dizzy probably won't fit under those carbies!

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dattoman_1000
Posted: 2002/10/18 11:52  Updated: 2002/10/18 11:52
No life (a.k.a. DattoMaster)
Joined: 2002/8/11
From: Perth
Posts: 2690
 Re: Head games
I had heard of an OS Giken twin cam head for the A series but they said they didn't do one.
I have also toyed with the idea of a B6 mazda crossflow head as apparently the head bolt holes and most water galleries line up. Though I haven't had a good look at this yet.
Not sure I like the way its close to the master cylinder....might be a pulse prob from the intake causing it to "run off" on #4. Though it would probably be great for the LHD brigade.
Its an interesting thought though
I'd like a DOHC setup for the racecar.