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| * Rear: 205mm width | * Rear: 205mm width | ||
| *: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=10669 http://datsun1200.com/modules/myalbum/photos/thumbs/10669.jpg] | *: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/myalbum/photo.php?lid=10669 http://datsun1200.com/modules/myalbum/photos/thumbs/10669.jpg] | ||
| - | You will need special wheels (possibly with [[Wheels|wheel spacers]] and [[Rolling the Guard]]) to fit this rubber into a 1200. | + | You will need +30 offset wheels (possibly with [[Rolling the Guard]]) to fit this rubber into a 1200. |
| - | Anything from 12-inch diameter to 17-inch diameter tires can fit a 1200. The important factor is the tire height. A low-profile 17" will fit better than a regular-profile 14" tire. | + | Anything from 12-inch diameter to 17-inch diameter tires can fit a 1200. The important factor is the tire height. A low-profile 16" will fit better than a regular-profile 13" tire. Yes, a 205/40R16 is smaller in height than a 155/80R13. |
| A common upgrade configuration is 175/70 13" on the front, and 185/60-13 on the back. | A common upgrade configuration is 175/70 13" on the front, and 185/60-13 on the back. | ||
| Line 31: | Line 31: | ||
| == Ute == | == Ute == | ||
| - | From the 1978 B120 factory service manual (English RHD/LHD): | + | From the 1978 [[Factory Service Manual]] for [[B120]] (English RHD/LHD): |
| * Front Tire size: 5.00-12-4PRULT (tubed) | * Front Tire size: 5.00-12-4PRULT (tubed) | ||
| * Rear Tire size: 5.00-12-8PRULT (tubed) | * Rear Tire size: 5.00-12-8PRULT (tubed) | ||
| Line 48: | Line 48: | ||
| = Front Tires = | = Front Tires = | ||
| - | With commonly available wheels, 175 or 185 tire will fit nicely. | + | With a +30 offset wheel, 175 or 185 tire will fit nicely. |
| A 175x60x13 tyre usually takes a 5-inch wide rim. At 540mm in diameter, they are even smaller than the stock Datsun 1000 tyre [552mm] & a lot smaller than a stock 1200 tyre [574mm]. | A 175x60x13 tyre usually takes a 5-inch wide rim. At 540mm in diameter, they are even smaller than the stock Datsun 1000 tyre [552mm] & a lot smaller than a stock 1200 tyre [574mm]. | ||
| = Rear Tires = | = Rear Tires = | ||
| - | |||
| The 205x60x13 measures 576mm in diameter, virutually the same diameter as the stock Datsun 1200 12" tires, so this retains the original gearing, & they were designed around a 5 to 7" rim (5-1/2" wheel recommended). Although if you are going to run these tyres on a 13" rim it leaves a lot less room to lower the car without extensive guard work. | The 205x60x13 measures 576mm in diameter, virutually the same diameter as the stock Datsun 1200 12" tires, so this retains the original gearing, & they were designed around a 5 to 7" rim (5-1/2" wheel recommended). Although if you are going to run these tyres on a 13" rim it leaves a lot less room to lower the car without extensive guard work. | ||
| 185x60x13 tyres measure 552mm in diameter, the same as the 1000's 5-50x12's which is smaller than the 1200's stock size [574mm] | 185x60x13 tyres measure 552mm in diameter, the same as the 1000's 5-50x12's which is smaller than the 1200's stock size [574mm] | ||
| I too have found that slightly larger diameter rear tyres usually brings the odometer much closer into line with true distance traveled, & if the odometer is right, then the speedo is usually closer to the mark too. | I too have found that slightly larger diameter rear tyres usually brings the odometer much closer into line with true distance traveled, & if the odometer is right, then the speedo is usually closer to the mark too. | ||
| - | |||
| 1200 had a 155SR12 standard fitment = 155/80*12, which is almost identical to a 185/60*13 give or take 0.6mm | 1200 had a 155SR12 standard fitment = 155/80*12, which is almost identical to a 185/60*13 give or take 0.6mm | ||
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| = Low-profile Tyres = | = Low-profile Tyres = | ||
| Low-profile tires have better handling qualities, turn-in, etc. But ride rougher. 60-series tires are harsher than 80-series tires, but most people will find they feel better when cornering hard. | Low-profile tires have better handling qualities, turn-in, etc. But ride rougher. 60-series tires are harsher than 80-series tires, but most people will find they feel better when cornering hard. | ||
| + | |||
| + | Rule of Thumb | ||
| + | Comfort: Choose 80-series tires | ||
| + | Economy: Choose 80-series tires | ||
| + | Sporty: Choose 70-series tires | ||
| + | Performance: Choose 60-series tires | ||
| + | Competition: Choose 55 or 40-series tires | ||
| Discussion: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6522&forum=1 availability of wide tires] | Discussion: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6522&forum=1 availability of wide tires] | ||
| Line 72: | Line 77: | ||
| * 165/70R12 | * 165/70R12 | ||
| * 175/70R13 | * 175/70R13 | ||
| - | * 185/60R14 | + | * 185/60R13 |
| [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9191&forum=1&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0 speedo and tire size discussion] | [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=9191&forum=1&start=20&viewmode=flat&order=0 speedo and tire size discussion] | ||
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| = 15", 16" or 17" wheels = | = 15", 16" or 17" wheels = | ||
| Sure, 15", 16" or 17" wheels can fit a 1200 easily. It's the width and ''overall tire height'' that is important, not the diameter of the wheel. | Sure, 15", 16" or 17" wheels can fit a 1200 easily. It's the width and ''overall tire height'' that is important, not the diameter of the wheel. | ||
| + | |||
| + | Generally you want a +30 offset wheel for tires up to 175-wide. See [[Offset]] for more details. | ||
| Discussion: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6783&forum=1 my new wheels (15")] | Discussion: [http://datsun1200.com/modules/newbb/viewtopic.php?topic_id=6783&forum=1 my new wheels (15")] | ||
| - | If the tires are too tall, they hit the front strut spring cups. Change struts to [[Strut Swaps|Stanza struts]] to work around this. | ||
| + | Unless the tires are shorter than stock, if the offset is wrong, the tires hit the front strut spring cups. | ||
| + | * Change struts to [[Strut Swaps|Stanza struts]] to space the wheel out further | ||
| + | * Use more negative offset (e.g. Zero) to space the wheel out further | ||
| + | * Use a slightly narrower tire. 175 front and 195 rear fit with a +30 offset wheel | ||
| + | * Use a lower profile tire | ||
| - | = Donor Cars = | ||
| - | Cars that used 12" tires: | ||
| - | * 1987-1990 Chevrolet Sprint (145SR12) | ||
| - | * Datsun B10 | ||
| - | * Datsun B210 with/A12 | ||
| - | * Datsun B310 with/A12 (except USA) | ||
| - | * Toyota Corolla 1200 | ||
| - | * Honda Civic | ||
| - | * 1978-1981 Ford Fiesta (155-12) | ||
| - | * 1986-1993 Ford Festiva (4 on 4.5 wheels) | ||
| - | * 1989-1994 Geo Metro (12x4, 4 on 4.5 wheels) (145SR12) | ||
| - | * BMC Mini Cooper | ||
| - | * 1991 Nissan Figaro | ||
| - | * 1988-1995 Subaru Justy (145/80R12) | ||
| = Wide Tires = | = Wide Tires = | ||
| - | Yes, stay with the wider tires, you'll be happier I think. The 155s are a bit weak for cornering (I currently have 155s).The advantage of 155/12 is that they are dirt cheap, with many wreckers practically giving them away (e.g. $10 mounted). They were still being produced massively for cars such as Suzuki Swift (Geo Metro), Honda Civic, etc, though in the late '2000s production is cut back and fewer models are available. Sometimes the discount new tire stores sell them $80/four mounted & balanced. Check the Sports section of the newspaper for the occasional tire ad. | + | Yes, stay with the wider tires, you'll be happier I think. The 155s are a bit weak for cornering (I currently have 155s). The advantage of 155/12 is that they are inexpensive, give the best fuel economy and the best riding comfort. |
| Maximum tire width without fender flares: Rear: 205, Front: 185 | Maximum tire width without fender flares: Rear: 205, Front: 185 | ||
| - | For example, 205/50R15 with 15x6 wheels. | + | For example, 205/50R15 with 15x6 offset 30 wheels. |
| - | Bluebird TRX (Maxima/910) wheels. | + | Bluebird TRX (Maxima/910) wheels (with spacers?) |
| <blockquote><hr>I'd go with 7" rims, simply because if you use 6" rims you're really limiting yourself to a 185/60 tyre. Anything wider and you loose a bit of crispness and steering response. | <blockquote><hr>I'd go with 7" rims, simply because if you use 6" rims you're really limiting yourself to a 185/60 tyre. Anything wider and you loose a bit of crispness and steering response. | ||
| Line 113: | Line 110: | ||
| - | [[Rolling the Guard]] will help you get that little bit of room for wheels that are almost right. Use a baseball bat. Search the Main Forum for discussions on this technique. | + | [[Rolling the Guard]] will help you get that little bit of room for wheels that are almost right. Use a baseball bat. |
| + | |||
| = Where to buy 12" Tires = | = Where to buy 12" Tires = | ||
| Line 123: | Line 121: | ||
| * 165/55R12 is available in USA | * 165/55R12 is available in USA | ||
| * 175/70R12 is available in Australia as of November 2011 | * 175/70R12 is available in Australia as of November 2011 | ||
| + | |||
| + | |||
| + | == Donor Cars == | ||
| + | Cars that used 12" tires: | ||
| + | * 1987-1990 Chevrolet Sprint (145SR12) | ||
| + | * Datsun B10 | ||
| + | * Datsun B210 with/A12 | ||
| + | * Datsun B310 with/A12 (except USA) | ||
| + | * Toyota Corolla 1200 | ||
| + | * Honda Civic | ||
| + | * 1978-1981 Ford Fiesta (155-12) | ||
| + | * 1986-1993 Ford Festiva (4 on 4.5 wheels) | ||
| + | * 1989-1994 Geo Metro (12x4, 4 on 4.5 wheels) (145SR12) | ||
| + | * BMC Mini Cooper | ||
| + | * 1991 Nissan Figaro | ||
| + | * 1988-1995 Subaru Justy (145/80R12) | ||
| + | |||
| == Summit Racing == | == Summit Racing == | ||
| Line 145: | Line 160: | ||
| Here's a report from 2000: | Here's a report from 2000: | ||
| - | <br>Best place to find 12 inch tires is a wrecking yard. They came on 1996 Geo Metro, 1994 Ford Festiva, 1990 Subaru Justy, older Honda Civics, Ford Fiesta and many other small cars. Expect to pay $10 each for like-new tires, mounted in western USA yard. | + | <br>Best place to find 12 inch tires is a wrecking yard. They came on 1996 Geo Metro, 1994 Ford Festiva, 1990 Subaru Justy, older Honda Civics, Ford Fiesta and many other small cars. Expect to pay $10 each for like-new tires, mounted in western USA yard... They were still being produced massively for cars such as Suzuki Swift (Geo Metro), Honda Civic, etc, though in the late '2000s production is cut back and fewer models are available. Sometimes the discount new tire stores sell them $80/four mounted & balanced. Check the Sports section of the newspaper for the occasional tire ad. |
| == Delticom == | == Delticom == | ||
Revision as of 07:29, 27 December 2011
The standard equipment tires for Datsun 1200 were Bridgestone 12-inch diameter 6.00 width 4-ply (bias) tire. At least in the USA, they were whitewall tires. Optional tires were 155SR12 radial tires. Stock wheels today willl use 155SR-12 (155 mm tread width) on a 4" wide wheel. These are optimum for fuel economy as they have low friction.
Contents |
Overview
Sales Window Sticker - Whitewalls N/C - Optional Radial
The largest width tire that fits a stock 1200 body are:
- Front: 185 mm width
- Rear: 205mm width
-
You will need +30 offset wheels (possibly with Rolling the Guard) to fit this rubber into a 1200.
Anything from 12-inch diameter to 17-inch diameter tires can fit a 1200. The important factor is the tire height. A low-profile 16" will fit better than a regular-profile 13" tire. Yes, a 205/40R16 is smaller in height than a 155/80R13.
A common upgrade configuration is 175/70 13" on the front, and 185/60-13 on the back.
Daily Care
USA 1972 Owners manual (see pages 26-27 for tire details):
Recommended cold inflation: 22 psi
155 SR 12 radial tires
Ute
From the 1978 Factory Service Manual for B120 (English RHD/LHD):
- Front Tire size: 5.00-12-4PRULT (tubed)
- Rear Tire size: 5.00-12-8PRULT (tubed)
Pressure
- Front: 22 psi
- Rear, Partial Load: 28 psi
- Rear, Maximum Load: 47 psi
Pressure, High Speed (above 100kph/60mph)
- Front: 26 psi
- Rear, Partial Load: 31 psi
- Rear, Maximum Load: 51 psi
NOTE: Inflation pressure should be measured when tires are cold.
Front Tires
With a +30 offset wheel, 175 or 185 tire will fit nicely.
A 175x60x13 tyre usually takes a 5-inch wide rim. At 540mm in diameter, they are even smaller than the stock Datsun 1000 tyre [552mm] & a lot smaller than a stock 1200 tyre [574mm].
Rear Tires
The 205x60x13 measures 576mm in diameter, virutually the same diameter as the stock Datsun 1200 12" tires, so this retains the original gearing, & they were designed around a 5 to 7" rim (5-1/2" wheel recommended). Although if you are going to run these tyres on a 13" rim it leaves a lot less room to lower the car without extensive guard work.
185x60x13 tyres measure 552mm in diameter, the same as the 1000's 5-50x12's which is smaller than the 1200's stock size [574mm] I too have found that slightly larger diameter rear tyres usually brings the odometer much closer into line with true distance traveled, & if the odometer is right, then the speedo is usually closer to the mark too.
1200 had a 155SR12 standard fitment = 155/80*12, which is almost identical to a 185/60*13 give or take 0.6mm
Low-profile Tyres
Low-profile tires have better handling qualities, turn-in, etc. But ride rougher. 60-series tires are harsher than 80-series tires, but most people will find they feel better when cornering hard.
Rule of Thumb Comfort: Choose 80-series tires Economy: Choose 80-series tires Sporty: Choose 70-series tires Performance: Choose 60-series tires Competition: Choose 55 or 40-series tires
Discussion: availability of wide tires
Easy swaps to larger tires
These keep your speedometer reading close, and fit under the stock fenders and over the stock brakes:
- 165/70R12
- 175/70R13
- 185/60R13
speedo and tire size discussion
15", 16" or 17" wheels
Sure, 15", 16" or 17" wheels can fit a 1200 easily. It's the width and overall tire height that is important, not the diameter of the wheel.
Generally you want a +30 offset wheel for tires up to 175-wide. See Offset for more details.
Discussion: my new wheels (15")
Unless the tires are shorter than stock, if the offset is wrong, the tires hit the front strut spring cups.
- Change struts to Stanza struts to space the wheel out further
- Use more negative offset (e.g. Zero) to space the wheel out further
- Use a slightly narrower tire. 175 front and 195 rear fit with a +30 offset wheel
- Use a lower profile tire
Wide Tires
Yes, stay with the wider tires, you'll be happier I think. The 155s are a bit weak for cornering (I currently have 155s). The advantage of 155/12 is that they are inexpensive, give the best fuel economy and the best riding comfort.
Maximum tire width without fender flares: Rear: 205, Front: 185 For example, 205/50R15 with 15x6 offset 30 wheels. Bluebird TRX (Maxima/910) wheels (with spacers?)
I'd go with 7" rims, simply because if you use 6" rims you're really limiting yourself to a 185/60 tyre. Anything wider and you loose a bit of crispness and steering response.You could get 13s over your brakes with a 205/60 tyre. Or run 14*7" with a 195/60 tyre. Difference in gearing is about 5%.
reference: LB18_110 on 1200 coupe race car
Rolling the Guard will help you get that little bit of room for wheels that are almost right. Use a baseball bat.
Where to buy 12" Tires
Stock size is 155R12. Do not get the narrower 145R12 which were used by the Subaru Justy 3-cylinder car.
But can you still get wide 12" tires? Sure:
- 165/60R12 are available in Britain and USA as of November 2011 -- they are used on Minis
- 165/55R12 is available in USA
- 175/70R12 is available in Australia as of November 2011
Donor Cars
Cars that used 12" tires:
- 1987-1990 Chevrolet Sprint (145SR12)
- Datsun B10
- Datsun B210 with/A12
- Datsun B310 with/A12 (except USA)
- Toyota Corolla 1200
- Honda Civic
- 1978-1981 Ford Fiesta (155-12)
- 1986-1993 Ford Festiva (4 on 4.5 wheels)
- 1989-1994 Geo Metro (12x4, 4 on 4.5 wheels) (145SR12)
- BMC Mini Cooper
- 1991 Nissan Figaro
- 1988-1995 Subaru Justy (145/80R12)
Summit Racing
No Longer Available
- 165/70 SR12 Yokohama Y372 $56 SummitRacing.com NLA
TalonTire.com
November 2011
- 165/60R12 Falken FK06G $99
- 165/60R12 Falken Ziex ZE-912 $109
- 165/60R12 Yokohama A539 $126
7ent.com
November 2011
- 165/55R12 165/12 Yokohama A048R Track Tire $179
- 165/12 Falken ZE912 $106
- 165/60R12 Yokohama A539 $120
Wrecking Yards
It used to be the best place to buy 12" tires, but alas no longer as new cars stopped using them about 15 years ago.
Here's a report from 2000:
Best place to find 12 inch tires is a wrecking yard. They came on 1996 Geo Metro, 1994 Ford Festiva, 1990 Subaru Justy, older Honda Civics, Ford Fiesta and many other small cars. Expect to pay $10 each for like-new tires, mounted in western USA yard... They were still being produced massively for cars such as Suzuki Swift (Geo Metro), Honda Civic, etc, though in the late '2000s production is cut back and fewer models are available. Sometimes the discount new tire stores sell them $80/four mounted & balanced. Check the Sports section of the newspaper for the occasional tire ad.
Delticom
Delticom USA http://tires-easy.com
November 2011 low profile
- Nankang CX688 165/70R12 $57
- Yokohama Y372 165/70R12 $66
November 2011 - snow tire
- Hankook Zovac HP W401 155 R12 studdable $46
November 2001 - standard
- Nankang CX688 155/80R12 $44
- Falken SN-807 155/80R12 $55
- Hercules G2000T 155/80R12 $52 A-A rated
- Westlake H120 155/R12 6PR Load Range C $52
- Camac NC80 155/80R12 $52
- Classic All Season 155/80R12 $57
- Vanderbilt Classic 155/80R12 $60
- Federal SS-657 155/80R12 $63 AA rating
November 2011 - heavy duty tires
- Westlake H200 155/R12 6PR Load Range C $50
- Goodride H120 155/R12 6PR Load Range C $51
- Double King DK207 155/R12C 8PR Load Range D $54
- Falken R-51 155/R12C 8PR Load Range D $61
No Longer Available
- Delta National Performance 155/80 R12
- Delta National Metric 155/80 R12
- VeeRubber VTR 307 Trailmate 307 155/70 R12
TireRack
Limited availability -- check the web site
- 155/80-12
- 165/70-12
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/sizes/results.jsp?diameter=12
MiniMania
November 2011
- Yokohama A048R 165/55-R12 $220
- Yokohama A539 165/60-R12 $130
- Falken 165/70-R12 $120
165/55-R12 -- the lowest, baddest small tires on the planet
Tire size comparison
155/80-12 21.7 inch diameter 165/70-12 21.4" 155SR-13 22.8" 175/70-13 22.6"
NOTE: 165-width tires want a 4-1/2" to 6" wide wheel.
Tyre Size Calculations
Here is a tire height calculations:
Stock tire:
155/80R12 21.8"
165/70R12 21.1 (+ 3% speedometer reading)
205/40R14 20.5
185/50R13 20.3
175/50R13 19.9
165/60R12 19.8 (+ 9%)
165/50R13 19.5
205/40R13 19.5
165/55R12 19.1 (+12%)
175/70R13 22.6
195/50R15 22.7
205/45R17 23.5
205/40R18 24.4
http://www.discountpartcenter.com/tirecalc.html
or
http://www.1010tires.com/tiresizecalculator.asp
So that's the disadvantage of low-profile tires: your speedometer will read too fast and the effective gearing will increase, making it rev even higher on the freeway ...What about tires for 13" or larger wheels?
Example
Lowering Tires
Stock (option) tires: 155/80R12 21.8"
- sidewall: 4.9"
- radius: 10.9
- dia: 21.8
- cir: 68.4
- revs/mi:927.0
Replaced by lower-profile tires: 165/55R12 Yokohama A048R
- sidewall: 3.6
- radius: 9.6
- dia:19.1
- cir:60.1
- revs/mi:1053.0
Results: Speedometer reading 12% too fast. When your speedo reads 60mph -- if it was accurate with the stock tires -- with the new tires you are actually traveling 52.8 mph.
It is also similar to going from the 3.9 diff to a 4.368 ratio. You will feel more torque, but the engine revs higher for each actual road speed.
Suppliers
Wreckers are your best bargain here ... lots of 13" tyres, even some 12s. Lots of 12s avaiable in US junk yards
Mail order
See Also
Discussions: