unfamilia wrote:
And none of them really effective in our country for speeds below 110kmh- not really practical here- but neither is an awd system either

Rallytwit wrote:
At the risk of over simplification: fit the widest stickiest tires you can for pure grip. The too much power for a light car kinda doesn't really hold water for me.................Brabham BT45 (I think) F1 car, 1200lbs and 1200 horsepower in qualifying trim didn't have this issue becuase it features massive slicks that were up to temp, a street car is not going to have heat in the tires at a level you get at the track...................which brings me to why I don't get the whole street racing thing. Dirty tarmac cold tires etc.................what's the point.

Now you can optimize the suspension and run the best tire possible. There are all sorts of things you can do with damper setting and suspension geometry and tire pressures etc to get more out of a car etc. The notion that a light car can have to much power is silly..........................focus on getting the power to the ground, if you don't want to run the best set up for this, then yes wheel spin is going to be a by product.

Tom

D wrote:
I want a better picture of this V8Z any chance we can have a few more uploaded to perv on?

jmac wrote:
l18-b110 - I keep squeezing the other things in because it is important. Hell I didn't even mention that the wider the tyre the less camber it tends to 'like' - which can be indicative of things.

jmac wrote:

Of course f1 (or anyone else) is running the widest tyres they can (or what they must run) - you're mis-interpreting what I'm getting at. The reason to run wider tyres is not because they grip better 'per se' - if that's the case I welcome you to get some bob jane australian all rounder tread put on some 265 width tyres, and I'll bring some toyo ra1s around to compare. What I am saying is the _reason_ for the widest tyre possible in a racing situation is to give the opportunity to run the stickiest compound possible, but still get enough tyre life to finish enouh laps between pitstops (or the sprint race distance or whatever). It's not just the width.

jmac wrote:

If you wouldn't mind (and I ask this sincerely, not as a smartalec) - do you happen to have pyrometer readings for the tread - possibly - outer and inner edges and centre region - for the tyres you ran that had the big difference before and after. It'd be interesting to see the spread of temp - both from before and after different tyres, but also to know what temps they ran across the width of the tread, it might be enlightening (to me, if no-one else)


What I was trying to get at, and I'll re-state it (and I know you've said that you would go along with this, and as such we are both sort of talking about two slightly different but related tangents) tread compound is the big deal. It's (relatively) hard to overheat tyres on the street, in most parts of this country, and I can't speak for elsewhere, you'd probably end up getting arrested if you drove hard enough and long enough to overwhelm the tyres. Brake pads - well it'd be relatively hard to overcook a1rms with a bit of touring on twisty roads, but certainly possible on a circuit.

jmac wrote:
I'm DEFINITELY not advocating running 155 width tyres or anything. I hope I haven't come across like that. Perhaps I'll restate it better thusly - width isn't 'all that' I'm not saying run bicycle tyres, but find the specific brands in the wider sizes that have a good track record, it will make or break the deal. There's (unfortunately) seemingly no shortage of tyres available that are 'big' that are also very mediocre as far as grip is concerned.

the same thing applies to brake pads. 'larger' pads, which wrap further around the disc, don't stop better, unless you are reaching the temp limits of the smaller pads. (*if the pad material is the same). The same is true of brake shoe width. IF you are getting them quite hot, then sure, wider is better, but for single stops (or a handful of multiple stops) it won't change things. NOW bigger diameter discs, same pads, definitely improve things, because then they get more leverage.

and one more thing - that's a wicked machine mate.

jmac wrote:
l18-b110 - I keep squeezing the other things in because it is important. Hell I didn't even mention that the wider the tyre the less camber it tends to 'like' - which can be indicative of things.

jmac wrote:

Of course f1 (or anyone else) is running the widest tyres they can (or what they must run) - you're mis-interpreting what I'm getting at. The reason to run wider tyres is not because they grip better 'per se' - if that's the case I welcome you to get some bob jane australian all rounder tread put on some 265 width tyres, and I'll bring some toyo ra1s around to compare.

jmac wrote:

What I am saying is the _reason_ for the widest tyre possible in a racing situation is to give the opportunity to run the stickiest compound possible, but still get enough tyre life to finish enouh laps between pitstops (or the sprint race distance or whatever). It's not just the width.

jmac wrote:

If you wouldn't mind (and I ask this sincerely, not as a smartalec) - do you happen to have pyrometer readings for the tread - possibly - outer and inner edges and centre region - for the tyres you ran that had the big difference before and after. It'd be interesting to see the spread of temp - both from before and after different tyres, but also to know what temps they ran across the width of the tread, it might be enlightening (to me, if no-one else)

jmac wrote:

I'm DEFINITELY not advocating running 155 width tyres or anything. I hope I haven't come across like that.

jmac wrote:

IF (and it's a big if) the tread compound is identical - then a 235 will provide exactly the same grip as a 195 width tyre.

Rallytwit wrote:
and I think you dont get it cuz its not for you. think of it this way A LOT of people dont get wtf we mod cars either in their eyes "whats the point?". different things work for different people.
btw im no way encouraging street racing, but i do my fare share of back road racing. and I do my fare share of mountain runs on motorcycle. Im sure people also dont get that to lol......................As someone who used to road race motorcycles I completely get riding quickly but what I don't get is trying to go reeeeally fast on the street, there is so much less traction available on public roads that the corner speeds are slower than yer basic warm up lap.................this is a particularly acute problem for me as my road racing background is in 2-stroke GP bikes, mostly 125cc but the occasional ride on TZ250's...........................if you haven't been on track with your bike, you must try it at least once, it's just an absolute scream.......you can slide the bike around like a hoon and not have to worry about what junk is on the tarmac...................with all that said I have threatened to put Super Moto Wheels on my KTM 300 (it's plated / street legal)............I'm also considering a new Beta 520 dual sport (you can slide a bike around on dual sport tires in a fairly alarming manner if you choose)

OK back on topic:
I can't remember exactly on shock settings for drags but I would imagine if you set the compression on the rear shocks a little softer and the rebound a little harder then the optimal road race set up that would help the rear bite. Sway bars selection shouldn't affect the straight line acceleration (anyone feel free to correct me if I'm wrong). As for ride height you could run the rear a touch lower / biased toward the rear, obviously it would have a little more understeer than the optimal road race set up. If you have a test n tune night at your local drags you could use that to dial in as much grip as possible............then maybe take it to a local autocross to make sure it still handles acceptable although once you round the first freeway on ramp you'll likely know . Grippy tires and a limited slip diff would also be a must as mentioned.

Tom