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| == Ford 8.8 == | == Ford 8.8 == | ||
| - | The Ford 8.8 is a good choice -- it can handle extreme torque, nearly as much as the 9" but considerably lighter. LSD and possible disc brakes a well as cheap and easy to find makes this a top option. | + | The Ford 8.8 is a good choice -- it can handle extreme torque, nearly as much as the 9" but considerably lighter. LSD as well as cheap and easy to find makes this a top option. |
| Ford Ranger 8.8 can be narrowed at home to fit a Datsun. Housing on one side only needs narrowing, and stock axles can be used. Obtain an additional short-side axle and cut only one side of the axle housing to shorten it. | Ford Ranger 8.8 can be narrowed at home to fit a Datsun. Housing on one side only needs narrowing, and stock axles can be used. Obtain an additional short-side axle and cut only one side of the axle housing to shorten it. | ||
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| Do the same as mounting an LSD-fitted rear axle assembly: Cut & grind the 4-link brackets off, then weld spring perches on. | Do the same as mounting an LSD-fitted rear axle assembly: Cut & grind the 4-link brackets off, then weld spring perches on. | ||
| - | Ranger 4.0 1990-1992 has the shortest 8.8 with 28-spline axles. Look for axle tag 3L73 (limited slip). It will be 53" after converting to two short axles. Same [[Diff Widths]] as 510 or S110. Will fit a 1200 using high-offset wheels. | + | Mazda B4000 and Ford Ranger 4.0 1990-1992 have the shortest 8.8 with 28-spline axles (1993-up are 1.5" wider). 28-spline is used by Mustang V8, so they are strong. Look for door tag AX R6, and confirm with axle tag 3L73 (limited slip). 4x4s have 4.10. It will be 53" after converting to two short axles. Same [[Diff Widths]] as 510 or S110. Will fit a 1200 using high-offset wheels. |
| The axle tubes are held in with a pressed-in plug. Drill the plug out, press the tube out, cut it to size using cut off for perfect straight cut. Align the axle end straight on tube, weld the plug hole, then weld the tube to the end. | The axle tubes are held in with a pressed-in plug. Drill the plug out, press the tube out, cut it to size using cut off for perfect straight cut. Align the axle end straight on tube, weld the plug hole, then weld the tube to the end. | ||
| - | Bolt pattern 5-on-4.5 (same as RX7) with drum brakes. | + | Bolt pattern 5-on-4.5 (same as RX7) with 10" drum brakes. |
| = Differential Gear Ratios = | = Differential Gear Ratios = | ||
Revision as of 21:59, 16 November 2012
What Diff and LSD should I use? The stock differential is a very lightweight yet hardy unit behind the small-bore 1200cc engine. However, there are three big reasons people swap differentials into their 1200:
- To handle increase torque of a larger engine. The stock unit won't handle well the torque even from an A14 engine.
- To gain access to available Limited Slip units. LSD for the stock differential is now quite rare and expensive.
- To get rear disc brakes.
Contents |
Definitions
Differential: The word "differential" refers to:
- The small gears in the rear end that control the left-to-right wheel speeds
- By popular usage it also refers to either:
- the center gear assembly (pumpkin), including Ring and Pinion and the carrier these bolt to, or
- the entire axle assembly including the housing, gears, axles etc.
Ring and Pinion (R&P) are the large final-drive gears e.g. the "ratio" gears. Known as "Crown Wheel and Pinion" (CWP) in British English.
Spider gears: The other smaller side gears are known as the "spider gears". These are the ones that actually allow a differential speed.
LSD: Limited-slip differential. Most designs use a spring-loaded clutch to prevent one wheel from spinning by itself. Instead, both will spin.
Strength of Differential -- Torque Rating
| diff | inches | max. torque capacity |
| H145 | 5.71 | ~100 lb. ft. |
| H150 | 5.91 | ~125 lb. ft. |
| H165 | 6.50 | ~225 lb. ft. |
| H190 | 7.49 | ~285 lb. ft. |
| R200 | 7.88 | ~300 lb. ft. |
| Ford 8 | 8.00 | ~325 lb. ft. |
| Ford 8.8 | 8.80 | ~500 lb. ft. |
| Ford 9 | 9.00 | ~600 lb. ft. |
Horsepower is irrelevent for the differential. What matters is the torque:
Engine Torque x gearbox multiplication = twisting force applied to differential
For example:
- A 400HP engine with 275 lb ft torque could get by with a much smaller diff than a blown 400HP engine with 500 lb ft torque. Yet both are 400 horsepower. Why does the second engine need a differential that's twice as strong? Because torque matters, HP is not directly related to the strength needed.
- A 'built' 125 hp A12 will versus a stock 125 hp 3-liter V6. You need a bigger diff for the latter since it has more torque.
- Lower first-gears in the transmission mean more torque gets to the differential. For example, the stock B110 4-speed first gear (3.757) will multiply torque more than the B310 5-speed first gear (3.513 in the 60a transmission).
The Datsun 1200's H145 differential is only safe for as much torque as an A12 puts out, or maybe as much as 100 lb. ft. of torque.
Datsun used the larger H150 for all A14-powered cars, this was good for maybe 125 lb. ft. of torque. The much larger H165 was good for maybe 225 lb. ft. of torque. Finally, the H190 was the big gun (approx. 7 1/2 inch ring gear) and good for maybe 285 lb. ft. of torque.
Stock Datsun 1200 Rear Axle
Coupes, Wagons and Sedan use the small H145 differential. 1975 and up Datsun 1200 Trucks use the stronger H165 differential.
Car Rear Axle
The stock rear-end assembly works great for the A12 or the A14 engine. This is the H145 (145mm diameter ring gear). The diff is open (non-limited-slip) and the diff assembly unbolts from the front of the axle assembly (like Ford 9", but much smaller). All 1200's (except newer utes) had the H145. Sedan coupe and Wagon had a 3.900 as standard and the Wagons optionally had a 4.11 ratio. The 4.11 ratio diff, when used in Wagons and [as standard] in vans have alloy center.
Datsun Competition (later Nismo) used to sell various ratios: 3.9, 4.111, 4.375, 4.625
LSD (Limited-Slip Differential) units were also available from Datsun Competition. Axle baffles and Oil Coolers were available from Nissan Competition Good for maybe 100 lb. ft. of torque
Datsun 1200 rear axle assembly width is 1305 mm drum to drum.
A15 Diffs If you have swapped an A15 into your 1200, the stock H145 differential isn't strong enough except maybe for use with an automatic transmission. Instead, use an H150 (as fitted to B210s and B310s) or larger differential.
B120 Early Truck
1971-1973 1200 trucks used the same H145 design as the sedan/coupe/wagon. Slight differences between all models.
B120 Late Truck Rear Axle
Newer Ute Differential Newer 1200 Utes (1974 and up) have a much bigger and stronger diff, the H165 (165mm diameter ring gear). This has stronger axles too.
H165
Good for maybe 225 lb. ft. of torque ??? Axle baffles and Oil Coolers were available from Nissan Competition There is one LSD for Type I, and another for Type II
Easy Swaps
B110/B120 axle
Coupe into Sedan into Wagon into Ute: All B110/B120 H145 rear-axle assemblies (housing, etc) generally interchange but may be small difference in the brake line routing, handbrake cable location etc. Also use the shock-mounting plates from the right vehicle:
1200 Shock Absorbers
TIP: Wagons had a alloy carrier.
B10
Use a B10 alloy diff to save a few pounds.
Size of B10 axle:
- 1240 mm drum to drum +- 2mm
- 910 mm distance between the leaf mounts, centre to centre
- 65 mm wide leaf mount plates
banjo housing (no backing plates,axles or drums)
B210 Japan (Hitachi) axle
The easiest swap is to get the entire rear-axle assembly from a 1975 or newer B210 with A14 (140Y) -- this is the H150 (150mm diameter ring gear). The main spring is 55mm longer, but the others can be used on the 1200.
See Bolts right in!
Japan diff
NOTE: The 1974 B210 uses an H145, although the housing is the new stronger design. H145 can be distinguished by studs, whereas H150 uses bolts to fasten the diff to the case.
B210s have a strong axle housing (axles tubes are larger, to 2.2 inch up from 2.0 inch, so U-bolts are different). The B210s use an isolation clamp (the axle tube is rubber mounted), and so the mounting pad is wider. You will need the clamps, u-bolts and shock mounts to do a swap. The housing also user larger ball 72x32x19 bearings (up from 62x32x16) with both inside and outside seals. The B110 only had one seal.
Because the H150 is longer, the driveshaft is shortened by 7mm. The housing face is 2mm toward front of car (diff gear is 5mm larger)
Datsun Competition (later Nismo) used to sell various ratios: 3.545, 3.7, 3.9, 4.111 for the H150.
Whilst NISMO produced H150 LSDs (Limited-Slip Differential), Axles baffles and Oil Coolers were not available from Nissan for the H150.
Good for maybe 125 lb. ft. of torque
You can also just put the H150 gear assembly in the stock H145 axle housing. You just need a 2mm spacer:
Pitroad Spacer
Use a B310 propeller shaft with H150 diff in B110.
B310 Rear Axle
The axle assembly from a B310 (Datsun 210/Sunny) uses the H150 differential. Although the H150 is stronger than the H145, you can just put the H150 into the Datsun 1200 rear axle assembly.
- All B310 axles are about 2" wider. So different offset wheels are need OR overfender flares.
- Driveshaft length for H145 will be different due to the longer nose of the H150
- VB310 square-back wagon (van) uses leaf springs and so can be easily fitted.
- Most B310 uses coil springs so it's not a good choice (need modifications). It's also 4 link, so you have to do some significant mods to mount it to the chassis. This involves grinding off the existing multiple brackets and welding on a leaf spring perch. Note that the B110 perches are for a smaller-diameter axle tube and so will not fit.
H145 leaf-spring axle vs B310 H150 coil-spring axle
A10 Wagon
1978-1981 Datsun A10 (Violet/510/Stanza) is same width and flange as B310 but is an H165 unit with 9" drum brakes.
- Leaf spring pads are 1000 mm center to center
- between outer edge of leaf and backing plate: 100 mm
- Backing plate to outer face of drum: 65 mm
- overall width drum to drum: 1000 + 65 + 65 + 60 leaf width = 1190 cm
B210 Borg Warner Axle
Australian 120Y 4-dr Sedans from July 1976 were locally assembled and used a Borg Warner rear axle assembly. (BW model 68). All were 3.889 ratio. The BW rear ends are pretty strong - meant to be stronger than H165. The BW68 is the same width as a 1200 H145 diff, but have a different input flange, so you will also need the matching 120Y-BW tailshaft. This is the same type of differential in the early Corollas.
BW - removable back cover
Japan - welded back cover
For more details, see main article: Borg Warner Differential
Truck
B120 Ute, B140 & B122 Sunny Truck: The next best swap (at least in countries that got 1200 utes) is to get a 1200 ute H165 assembly, although it may cost a bit if you can find one.
In North America, Nissan Motorsports used to sell the empty axle housing, axles and other parts. rear disc brakes are available for this axle housing.
The 1200 ute uses the H165 differential, which is strong enough for a stock CA18DET engine. It bolts right into a coupe or sedan, with this exception
- handbrake adapter fits in a slightly different in position
- make sure you get the ute rear brake fluid splitter
- the driveshaft is 25mm longer (than a B110 shaft) and has a different yoke
discussion: ute difference and ute history
Toyota
Corolla KE30 or KE55 will increase the track about 3", but is reportedly a bolt in.
An option for the Aussies out there is the Australian Toyota Corolla diff. KE30 and KE55 models used the same Borg Warner diff as the 120Y, but with longer axles & tubes. Approx 3" wider in total. this is useful if you have Stanza or similar front brakes, as those struts increase track by about the same amount. So you can use the same offset (fwd) wheels front and rear without looking kinda silly and undertyred at the back if you know what I mean. Using rwd offsets will require a little gaurd work depending on the width and tyre size used. The biggest reason for using the Corolla Borg Warner is the available ratios - 3.89 (manual), 4.1 or 4.3 (auto). A tag on the rear cover has the ratio stamped on it. The Corolla diffs have a different input flange, so you need a 120Y BorgWarner flange which is interchangeable with the Corolla's. You also need a 120Y Borg Warner tailshaft (for the matching flange)[Thanks L18_B110 for this info]
Toyota Axle Codes S series 6.38" (162mm) ring gear, Corolla, Starlet T series 6.7" (170mm) ring gear, Corolla, Cressida, Corolla F series 7.5" (190mm) ring gear, Supra, Cressida, Truck, Celica
Look on underbonnet ID plate
S292: 4.10 S314: 3.91
T282 = 4.10 T283 = 4.30 LSD T284 = LSD
F462 = 2.92 F392 = 3.15 F012 = 3.30 F382 = 3.41 F372 = 3.58 F302 = 3.73 F312 or F072 = 3.90/3.91 F082 = 4.11 F282 = 4.30
Other Strong Diffs and Choices
Rear-axle assemblies from many different cars be be swapped in the 1200 with minor or major modifications. Advantages are strength, LSD and gear ratio choices. Oh, and if you do the work yourself, swapping in a unit could be cheaper than buying just a new ring & pinion.
Near Bolt-Ins
Non-narrowed rears (with possibly the assembly a little wider) will probably require moving/changing the leaf pads and minor fabrication of brake line connections and driveline flange.
Some reported units suitable for Datsun 1200 are:
- 1967 411 with alloy carrier (1160 mm)
-
- Ford Falcon ute complete rear which gave you LSD, a live rear, and discs
- Which Falcon model?
- Datsun 620 (pickup) front axle assembly with LSD
- 510, 610,710 station wagon (Davo_1200's 1200 used this diff).
Note that 510 sedans use IRS, a very long-snouted Subaru diff and LSD centre will fit found here in the US on the XT models. It is an 3.70:1 R160 by Fuji Heavy Industries (Subaru) and is the same as the OEM diff in the datsun 510 (1600) also made by Fuji. See R160 Swap.
Jeep
Postal jeeps -- leaf spring pads wider than CJ
Spring pads will need to be moved outboard to work in Datsuns.
late DJ Dana 35 7.5" 5-on-4.5 53"?
8.75 early DJ Dana 44 5-on-5.5 wheel bolt pattern most with LSD and 3.73 gears axle tubes are 2.75" -get the jeep u-bolts 49" or 50.5" hub-to-hub 27.5" spring pad width (very narrow) 11" brakes
Shortened
Just about any rear axle assembly can be narrowed to fit a 1200, with the right spring perches welded on. For example:
- Custom-built Ford 9" (kits are about $500-$700 USD from Currie Enterprises or Moser Engineering - includes housing and two axles, you add brakes and center section from any old Ford sedan)
- Toyota Hilux Pickup (6-bolt wheels on 4wd)(5 bolt wheels on 2wd, 4 1/2"pcd same as ford)
- 1960s Ford Falcon six-cylinder
- Falcon XK width: 1450 mm drum-to-drum
- Nissan Bluebird TRX
- Skyline Borg Warner LSD
- Datsun 520 pickup/ute with H190 diff
- H190 from Series 1 & 2 Bluebird wagons that came with the 4 speed trans
Width unknown, but these solid axles have the H165 center:
S110 Sylvia (1980-1984 200SX) 82s and 83s had optional disk brakes
S10 Sylvia (200SX, note 85-up S12 uses H190, R190 or R200 diff).
reference: site
For more information on vehicles with H190, see H190
- Mitsubishi Scorpion diff
Ford 8.8
The Ford 8.8 is a good choice -- it can handle extreme torque, nearly as much as the 9" but considerably lighter. LSD as well as cheap and easy to find makes this a top option.
Ford Ranger 8.8 can be narrowed at home to fit a Datsun. Housing on one side only needs narrowing, and stock axles can be used. Obtain an additional short-side axle and cut only one side of the axle housing to shorten it.
Do the same as mounting an LSD-fitted rear axle assembly: Cut & grind the 4-link brackets off, then weld spring perches on.
Mazda B4000 and Ford Ranger 4.0 1990-1992 have the shortest 8.8 with 28-spline axles (1993-up are 1.5" wider). 28-spline is used by Mustang V8, so they are strong. Look for door tag AX R6, and confirm with axle tag 3L73 (limited slip). 4x4s have 4.10. It will be 53" after converting to two short axles. Same Diff Widths as 510 or S110. Will fit a 1200 using high-offset wheels.
The axle tubes are held in with a pressed-in plug. Drill the plug out, press the tube out, cut it to size using cut off for perfect straight cut. Align the axle end straight on tube, weld the plug hole, then weld the tube to the end.
Bolt pattern 5-on-4.5 (same as RX7) with 10" drum brakes.
Differential Gear Ratios
See main articles:
H145 from 3.70 to 4.375 H150 from 3.545 to 4.11, LSD not available H165 from 3.545 to 4.875 H190 from 3.364 to 5.874
How to Identify Datsun Diffs
Here are some features to note to tell the difference:
- does center section bolt in?
- count bolt holes
- Measure distance across
- Does center bolt in, or fit onto studs with nuts?
Round or rectangular flange?
To check a Vanette diff,count the bolts holding the housing to the centre. if it's got 8, it's a H165, & the motor will be a a12. If however it's got 10, it's a H190 & the motor should be an a15. discussion: Vanette diff
H190
Axle comparison: H190 versus H165
H190 was used in most of the Datsun pickups, the 1960's Datsun Roadsters and other Datsuns.
To install a 4.375, 4.625 or 5.125 ring and pinion into a third member equipped with a 3.700, 3.889 or 4.111 ring and pinion a 4.0mm/.157" ring gear spacer must be fabricated. Due to a smaller pinion shaft, the 4.875 and 5.874 ring an [sic] and pinion sets are interchangeable, but cannot be installed into third members equipped with other ratios. Nissan Competition part catalog, 1984 edition pg 58
Datsun Competition used to sell various ratios: 3.36, 3.545, 3.7, 3.9, 4.111, 4.375, 4.625, 4.875, 5.143, 5.429.
There is one LSD for ratios up to 4.111, and another for the larger ratios
Axle baffles and Oil Coolers were available from Nissan Competition
Alloy Carrier
3486 
3487
R160, R180 and R190 These were IRS (Independent Rear Suspension) differentials with long snouts. Used in the Datsun 510, 610 and other IRS Datsuns as well as most Subarus. The R180 was used in the front axle of Datsun 4x4 trucks (720, etc).
Propeller Shafts
When swapping rear axle assemblies, the rule of thumb is:
get the matching shaft with the diff
In general, all B110, B210 and B310 driveshafts are the same (or close to same) overall length, but the ends differ:
- Auto vs. Manual
- Japan diff vs Borg Warner diff
- H145 vs H150 vs H165 diff
- Late ute vs Early ute
Coupe, Truck, Wagon and Sedan diffs are the same.
For more details on swapping and interchange of shafts, see Propeller Shaft Swaps.
Limited-Slip and Locking Differentials
A Limited Slip Differential (LSD) prevents one of the rear wheels slipping, as normally occurs with a regular diff.
See main article: LSD
Swap Consideration
The first rule is: There are no bolt-in swaps.
Considerations include:
Propeller Shaft (tailshaft/Driveshaft) Strength vs Weight Width Mounting brackets Brake hoses & lines Emergency (hand) brake cables Wheel bolt pattern Brake type & size
All the swaps proclaimed "bolt-in" require at the very least a change in the brake line and/or cables.
The only true bolt-ins are replacements. For example, replacing a broken 1200 sedan rear axle assembly with a good sedan rear axle assembly. Even going from coupe to sedan require some changes.
Miscellaneous
See also:
Brakes: for information on brakes, see tech section article Suspension & Brakes